[Dan]

- Fri Oct 21, 2016 11:49:03 pm #6865 On a weekend away up the coast, finally found a moment to get the laptop out. It's pissing down with rain and it's cold af, not the ideal weekend but I will give my thoughts on our Final 3 before I go and get jerked off and have some food etc

Something that is very important to me in life and in Stranded is the ability to be open and the willingness to adapt to new things. But I'd say that GROWTH is something I value in a big way. A lot of what I'mma say here will be covered in my speech too, but I feel like one of the F3 is really underrated in this game and I want to stand up for him and let y'all know the kind of person and player he truly is.

Tammy
I don't see what Penner saw in her? She never made that effort with me. With me she was nothing but small talk and Heidi's bitch, to be honest. The round Drew went home she also made up a lie about me at Tribal Council. She said I'd threatened her with 'grabbing her by the pussy' if she dared to vote for me. < This never happened, I had only ever been cordial with her in PM's. Being accused of something like that....it's disgusting and deceitful, and this is what sticks in my mind with her along with being Heidi's follower. She has NEVER gone out of her way to convince me or many of the jury that she was playing her own game. She needs to do a lot to earn my vote

Heidi
Perhaps the luckiest and worst player in the game. Let me paint you a picture:
She was at the mercy of myself (and Drew) on Pohnpei and I personally went out of my way to make sure we booted Cassandra instead of her, and I was honest with both of them about it. I even said to Heidi that the game changes quickly and she'd get an opportunity to survive and that I was in her corner. However, they decided the best course of action was to run me and other Indonesian players into the ground, with a little help from the hosts pushing an agenda that we all know wasn't even in existence.

So Cass goes, and I get this big PM from Heidi about how she's sorry and she knows the Indo stuff isn't true. It was nice and I responded positively, but TBH she was gone next after her antics at the last tribal. BUT, Nate saved her when he was the first to choose 'Greedy', sending his tribe to TC in the process. Heidi is saved again...but she's definitely gone next

But all of a sudden we do this double vote off shit and we get new tribe leaders, so Heidi and Rachel hand pick their ideal tribes and shock horror, I get the short end of the stick and am sentenced to death on Saipan. Over there suddenly Heidi doesn't talk to me, doesn't respond to PM's, does nothing but speak to her original tribemates and maybe Ozzy (you could confirm or deny that, Ozwald) ? She barely says a word to me and doesn't such may to Hayden either. It's clear that the plan is to vote me off but unluckily for her I was able to dominate a few challenges for Saipan and we got to the merge.

The merge:
Heidi gets saved not once, but twice by Ozzy sticking her neck out for her. 2 times she was saved because he thought it was best for his game...and the first time it was best for his game. 2nd time, well that's debatable but whatever.

The absolute funniest of all, the new 'extra vote' being allowed to be counted during that vote-switch period and Jeff literally GUIDING Tammy into her confessional so that she could cast her vote properly in order to tie the vote at 4-4. And here we are again, no one switches and we go to rocks. Heidi is saved again with a little help that she should have never received.

In conclusion, she was saved at least 5 god damn times and every time it was someone else saving her ass. She never did it herself. She was a total ass to several jury members, actively ignored some of us and was perhaps the most sickening human being possible to Sugar at times. So I ask myself, is that truly the best game out of this F3? Has Heidi or her goat really owned this game? Or have they gotten lucky over and over and over again?

Hayden
Some background on this kid; I played with him the WHOLE WAY up until my elimination. He was tightly aligned with me from pretty much day 1, so I feel I'm in a great position to judge the way he's played this game, especially in the rounds I played with him.

He was a little shy on Pohnpei at the start and I put a lot of energy into chatting with him and making him feel comfortable with me. and he did, he came out of his shell and was a great right hand man to me for a lot of this game. A lot of you don't realise it, but he played a huge role in some of the key decisions of this game pre-merge. He was able to hide that by appearing to be one of the lesser players but I really can't state enough how great of an ally and how good strategically he truly was. He was no mastermind, but throughout he was a good, smart and kindhearted kid who continued to improve as long as the game went on. He was able to avoid being targeted because everyone underestimated him, and he's really saved the best til last by winning that final immunity and not backing down on his decision to vote for Penner. I feel Penner would have won comfortably at the end and his ousting comes from Hayden's decision and Tammy's stupidity not to change her vote.

This is an All-Star season and I don't really feel that any of the 3 have played super top notch games, but I feel like one has played smart, has played fair and has played consistently well...and that's Hayden. He continued to grow and get better...and I'm honestly really proud of him getting this fair.

[Ozzy]

- Sat Oct 22, 2016 2:56:37 am #6867

Over there suddenly Heidi doesn't talk to me, doesn't respond to PM's, does nothing but speak to her original tribemates and maybe Ozzy (you could confirm or deny that, Ozwald) ?

Talked a lot to me about different plans/options. None of which came to fruition since we never went to tribal. Again, she was close to me so I got an inside look at things.

Heidi gets saved not once, but twice by Ozzy sticking her neck out for her. 2 times she was saved because he thought it was best for his game...and the first time it was best for his game. 2nd time, well that's debatable but whatever.

First time, definitely best move for my game (and her's obviously).
Second time, ended up being a good move for both of us (had I not botched my F5). After Sugar goes, the girls were voting Hayden or Penner. I pushed Hayden, for obvious reasons, and I think worst case scenario they take Hayden and vote Penner out instead. Either way, I'm in F4 with them and likely go out the same way Penner did. So I'll see it as a good move for me. But this isn't about my moves...

I'll try to write something up tomorrow since I feel like a big Heidi cheerleader, but I had an inside look at her game while you had an inside look at Hayden's game. So we both have a bias, right? Hayden will really have to show me he knew what the fuck he was doing all along, and REALLY convince me. Heidi has to do the same with you (although seems like your mind is made up). We all have the right to vote the way we see fit, the one beauty of being on the jury, but I think we really need to see their FTC speeches/responses to accurately see what they knew about the game the played. We can talk them up as much as we want, but if they didn't know the things that were happening or the moves they were making, then I'm not voting for them.

[Dan]

- Sat Oct 22, 2016 3:06:18 am #6868 My gripe with Heidi is the cowardly option of ignoring someone instead of fronting them. Honesty is a big thing for me and it's something I'm very proud of. I couldn't see myself voting for her right now for a lot of reasons, but one of those reasons is because I think she hasn't played a good game and it would really take a mighty FTC for her to win me over in that regard. Come the end of FTC I should know who has played better out of Heidi and Tammy, but overall their games don't stack up to Hayden's IMO. I think they even both misplayed their idols too.

I don't think it's a great F3 but I do believe we'll get a good winner when Hayden's done explaining his game at the end.

[Dan]

- Sat Oct 22, 2016 3:09:48 am #6870 Just re-reading the last tribal now. Heidi saying she doesn't think Drew or Danimal would vote Penner, and that shows a lack of jury knowledge. Penner played a great game and likely would have got my vote at the end, he killed the merge.

[Sierra]

- Sat Oct 22, 2016 3:27:35 am #6871 One thing I DON'T want Hayden to do coming into FTC is assume/act like he has the game won. They've all come too far for that shit. I worry that he might be semi-overconfident after everything that was said at the Penner tribal regarding his shot at winning now.

He's shown humility all game, and if he can explain everything the way I'm also confident he can (though I don't think I worked with him quite as closely as you did Dan), he can definitely win. I won't just vote for him simply based on how much I like him though... he's gonna have to back it the fuck up, and I bet he will.

[Sierra]

- Sat Oct 22, 2016 3:28:22 am #6872 Who would you have favored between JP and Hayden, Dan?

[Ozzy]

- Sat Oct 22, 2016 3:31:44 am #6873 @Danimal- I totally see where you're coming from. Like I said, we each have our reasons for voting the way we do! I also thought Penner wouldn't get a ton of votes in FTC. My view was totally skewed on him. And Hayden to be fair!

@Sierra- back it the fuck up is perfect haha. I want them all to own the game they think they played and we can go from there! Also, I know you didn't ask me, but I go Penner.

[Sierra]

- Sat Oct 22, 2016 3:43:38 am #6875 Oh no yeah I'm curious what would've happened in that situation. I do think Penner would've been the favorite. What you touched on is my favorite aspect of Penner's game, in that he sent people out and they liked him, yet it never bled into most of the in-game perceptions. That is the perfect "Derrick Levasseur" type jury management.

I have to agree with what Dan said about Heidi... she was hands down one of my favorite people in the game and still is, no doubt about it, but as a jury member... idk, I've always been really averse to voting for players who came SO close to the boot multiple times, in particular when IMO there are two other options who also played very solid games. That, plus things like saying (paraphrasing here) there are reasons that she would rather lose to Hayden than Penner based on a certain disrespect for Penner's style of game... you know, there was just no upside to her saying that kinda shit, seemed pointless af and yeah, very meh jury management.

[Val]

- Sat Oct 22, 2016 6:45:02 am #6878

Tammy
I don't see what Penner saw in her? She never made that effort with me. With me she was nothing but small talk and Heidi's bitch, to be honest. The round Drew went home she also made up a lie about me at Tribal Council. She said I'd threatened her with 'grabbing her by the pussy' if she dared to vote for me. < This never happened, I had only ever been cordial with her in PM's. Being accused of something like that....it's disgusting and deceitful, and this is what sticks in my mind with her along with being Heidi's follower. She has NEVER gone out of her way to convince me or many of the jury that she was playing her own game. She needs to do a lot to earn my vote.

Just fyi, Dan, idk if you were following the election here super closely, but I think she was making a joke about Trumps recorded comments about grabbing a woman by the pussy. You're kinda like the Trump of the game and I think she was just using oddly placed "political" humor.

[Dan]

- Sat Oct 22, 2016 6:51:24 am #6879 Yeah, I'm a Trump man so I knew all about that. The funniest thing is I actually believed her when she accused me of saying that, I just had no memory of it. Figured maybe I'd send that to her when I'd come on Stranded after a joint or something. But when I checked the PM's it was not the case. She did go pretty hard at me at that tribal which is fine, but keep it real you know.

[Ozzy]

- Sat Oct 22, 2016 6:52:26 am #6880

I have to agree with what Dan said about Heidi... she was hands down one of my favorite people in the game and still is, no doubt about it, but as a jury member... idk, I've always been really averse to voting for players who came SO close to the boot multiple times, in particular when IMO there are two other options who also played very solid games.

All players have to have some luck on their side to make it work. Some more than others, sure. But someone who came so close to the boot multiples times and is sitting in the final three? Why isn't that impressive to y'all? Hayden got lucky in his placement of Dan and you. Heidi got lucky with her placement of me. I think y'all did a shit ton more than Hayden did, just like I did a shit ton more than Heidi did. And yet here we fucking are, and there they fucking are.

I won't argue with Heidi's jury management and if that causes her to flounder, that's her own damn fault.

[Dan]

- Sat Oct 22, 2016 6:54:06 am #6881

Who would you have favored between JP and Hayden, Dan?

It's a really tough question. I think Penner played a bigger game and made more moves than almost anybody, but with that comes backstabbing and all that other shit that can piss off a jury. Personally I was never annoyed with JP so it wouldn't have affected my vote decision...but I honestly can't see who I would choose between the 2. It'd be one of those rare cases where you go to FTC and you really do need to ask the right questions and soak up everything that is said before you slap that vote in.

[Dan]

- Sat Oct 22, 2016 6:59:54 am #6882

I have to agree with what Dan said about Heidi... she was hands down one of my favorite people in the game and still is, no doubt about it, but as a jury member... idk, I've always been really averse to voting for players who came SO close to the boot multiple times, in particular when IMO there are two other options who also played very solid games.

All players have to have some luck on their side to make it work. Some more than others, sure. But someone who came so close to the boot multiples times and is sitting in the final three? Why isn't that impressive to y'all? Hayden got lucky in his placement of Dan and you. Heidi got lucky with her placement of me. I think y'all did a shit ton more than Hayden did, just like I did a shit ton more than Heidi did. And yet here we fucking are, and there they fucking are.

I won't argue with Heidi's jury management and if that causes her to flounder, that's her own damn fault.

The thing with her is that I never considered voting her off because I considered her to be a threat. She was just quite often the easy choice. She did get targeted again after I left, but was that because she was the biggest threat or because people just don't like her? I suppose out of her and Tammy she would have been considered by far the biggest threat by most of us, but other than that she never worried me in the game personally. I always knew where she stood. If she wasn't kissing my ass then she was working against me, so she was quite predictable to me.

Given she was often being saved by other people it also reduces the impressiveness of surviving those rounds a little bit. At least it does in my eyes

[Ozzy]

- Sat Oct 22, 2016 8:55:02 am #6885

I have to agree with what Dan said about Heidi... she was hands down one of my favorite people in the game and still is, no doubt about it, but as a jury member... idk, I've always been really averse to voting for players who came SO close to the boot multiple times, in particular when IMO there are two other options who also played very solid games.

All players have to have some luck on their side to make it work. Some more than others, sure. But someone who came so close to the boot multiples times and is sitting in the final three? Why isn't that impressive to y'all? Hayden got lucky in his placement of Dan and you. Heidi got lucky with her placement of me. I think y'all did a shit ton more than Hayden did, just like I did a shit ton more than Heidi did. And yet here we fucking are, and there they fucking are.

I won't argue with Heidi's jury management and if that causes her to flounder, that's her own damn fault.

The thing with her is that I never considered voting her off because I considered her to be a threat. She was just quite often the easy choice. She did get targeted again after I left, but was that because she was the biggest threat or because people just don't like her? I suppose out of her and Tammy she would have been considered by far the biggest threat by most of us, but other than that she never worried me in the game personally. I always knew where she stood. If she wasn't kissing my ass then she was working against me, so she was quite predictable to me.

Given she was often being saved by other people it also reduces the impressiveness of surviving those rounds a little bit. At least it does in my eyes

I always considered her a threat and I was working with her to an end point. I thought people thought the same (although based on a couple of sierras comments in game, that may be wrong?) and that when she was targeted it was for being threatening. Could be wrong though.

I do agree that she was more predictable. That's a good argument. Her being saved by other people, while it takes away from her flashiness, it still speaks to her connections in game. Without them she leaves, so that's a good move for her.

Again I can defend shit all I want, but if she doesn't defend it herself than it's a moot point.

I think what I'm taking away from this whole thing is that Tammy isn't winning. Was her biggest move being Heidi's second in command? Or was she the real mastermind behind them both?

[Sierra]

- Sat Oct 22, 2016 7:16:16 pm #6888 It does speak to her connections that she kept wiggling out of situations, and I agree you can argue it both ways. Without Heidi's good social game with many of us, she wouldn't have been able to get herself out of those tough spots, but I definitely think there was an element of luck to her sticking around through so many of those close calls. Not bashing anyone, but given that this is a really tough and close choice to me, sometimes I gotta nitpick... What if there was no second swap, giving Heidi a chance to go from the outhouse to the penthouse? What if an extra vote wasn't made available (this one's debatable since she did find it rounds in advance)? Like Dan mentioned, what if Nate didn't post "greedy"? And I know the answer to this in a lot of people's minds will be "yeah, but those are all what ifs". And I get that, but in this case I think they are valid ones in terms of her iffy game positioning, and a few bad relationships too.

A LOT of those things could've very, very easily gone down differently, which IMO most likely would have led to Heidi's boot at some point, based on what I've heard. Part of my jury questioning to her will probably touch on those things and I want to see how she responds to that criticism... I don't think it's an unfair one at all.

[Sierra]

- Sat Oct 22, 2016 7:17:23 pm #6889

I always considered her a threat and I was working with her to an end point. I thought people thought the same (although based on a couple of sierras comments in game, that may be wrong?) and that when she was targeted it was for being threatening. Could be wrong though.

Wait huh? What did I say in game? I thought Heidi was a massive threat fo sho.

[Jeff Probst]

- Sat Oct 22, 2016 9:31:01 pm #6892 This is a reminder to keep your own opinions and not to hive-mind the final Tribal. You should have open discussions not campaigns.

[Rocky]

- Sun Oct 23, 2016 3:42:07 am #6911

This is a reminder to keep your own opinions and not to hive-mind the final Tribal. You should have open discussions not campaigns.

exactly why i'm SHUTTIN MY MOUTH

see you guys at the post-game club, getting shwasted. poppin shots and shit. all the ladies are invited to my hotel for the night ;) ;) ;)

[Dan]

- Sun Oct 23, 2016 5:15:45 am #6919

This is a reminder to keep your own opinions and not to hive-mind the final Tribal. You should have open discussions not campaigns.

You should heed that advice when you question how people play the game at Tribal Councils.

[Richard]

- Sun Oct 23, 2016 5:07:29 pm #6925 It's really frustrating to see Hayden get acknowledge for playing well. He's really quite a bad player. Honestly, most of what he did this game was sit and wait for others to make decisions for him. He didn't make any decisions himself and never put himself out there. Dan, if you're talking about growth narrative's I don't see one with Hayden at all. I know from playing with him in Nepal that he's not at all savvy. Wasn't then. Isn't now. His PMs are transparent as hell. I just don't see why you guys would want to vote for him over 2 other players who have been working their asses off since day 1. Think about it. A fucking PAIR made it to the end. Not a secret pair. Not an unknown alliance. An entity known to the entire game since day 1. And they made it to the end together. That's unbelievable. If you ask me, one of them just HAS to be rewarded for that.